Top 10 Remodeling Contractors in Sunbury, OH

Porch Pro Headshot Conte Construction & Design/Window Depot USA Mid Ohio
We are a 5 Decade Family Remodeler , 3 generation company with over 10,000 Customers. Specialists of the entire house : Living Spaces , Kitchen & Bath, High end Windows & Doors , Energy Saving upgrades, Porches , Decks , Sunrooms & Patios - we do it all ! Named as One of Americas " Top 500 Remod...Read more about Conte Construction & Design/Window Depot USA Mid Ohio
100% response rate
We are a 5 Decade Family Remodeler , 3 generation company with over 10,000 Customers. Specialists of the entire house : Living Spaces , Kitchen & Bath, High end Windows & Doors , Energy Saving upgrades, Porches , Decks , Sunrooms & Patios - we do it all ! Named as One of Americas " Top 500 Remod...Read more about Conte Construction & Design/Window Depot USA Mid Ohio
Porch Pro Headshot Columbus Home Services
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(449)
"Very happy with my bathroom fix. After searching out quotes from multiple contractors, Jim was the only one that followed through on his quote when he promised. He replaced my flooring and re-tiled my shower in two days' time. The workmanship is impeccable. I'll be using Columbus Home Services ...Read more about Columbus Home Services
"Very happy with my bathroom fix. After searching out quotes from multiple contractors, Jim was the only one that followed through on his quote when he promised. He replaced my flooring and re-tiled my shower in two days' time. The workmanship is impeccable. I'll be using Columbus Home Services ...Read more about Columbus Home Services
Porch Pro Headshot C & J BASEMENT SOLUTIONS LLC
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(190)
"Our sump pump quit working on Thursday evening and water started backing up into our basement. I did have a backup one that had a defective battery so I was able to use that temporarily to stop the flooding and get the water under control. But it was quite clear something needed to be done. We h...Read more about C & J BASEMENT SOLUTIONS LLC
"Our sump pump quit working on Thursday evening and water started backing up into our basement. I did have a backup one that had a defective battery so I was able to use that temporarily to stop the flooding and get the water under control. But it was quite clear something needed to be done. We h...Read more about C & J BASEMENT SOLUTIONS LLC
Porch Pro Headshot Classic Exteriors Columbus/St. Clairsville
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(99)
"We hired Classic Exteriors to enhance our 3-seasons room and change it into a 4-seasons sun room. The finally product is phenomenal! We are so pleased with the new space and with Classic Exteriors. They are every bit professional and knowledgable, as well as courteous and respectful of the clien...Read more about Classic Exteriors Columbus/St. Clairsville
"We hired Classic Exteriors to enhance our 3-seasons room and change it into a 4-seasons sun room. The finally product is phenomenal! We are so pleased with the new space and with Classic Exteriors. They are every bit professional and knowledgable, as well as courteous and respectful of the clien...Read more about Classic Exteriors Columbus/St. Clairsville
Porch Pro Headshot Griffey Remodeling
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(222)
Griffey Remodeling is based in Columbus, OH and can provide all your remodeling needs.
Griffey Remodeling is based in Columbus, OH and can provide all your remodeling needs.
Porch Pro Headshot 1-800-USA-HOME
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(76)
Columbus Bath is a remodeling contractor located in Columbus. They are the Service Provider for Home Depot's Bathroom Remodeling Division. They have also been offering baseboard molding installation, acoustical construction, and home addition and more for 17 years.
Columbus Bath is a remodeling contractor located in Columbus. They are the Service Provider for Home Depot's Bathroom Remodeling Division. They have also been offering baseboard molding installation, acoustical construction, and home addition and more for 17 years.
Porch Pro Headshot Stackhouse Masonry LLC
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(20)
"All Around Labor Services, Paul Stackhouse, is excellent. Paul has done two major jobs for us, foundation repair and a complete chimney repair, top to bottom. Very pleased with both jobs, wonderful work and work ethic."
"All Around Labor Services, Paul Stackhouse, is excellent. Paul has done two major jobs for us, foundation repair and a complete chimney repair, top to bottom. Very pleased with both jobs, wonderful work and work ethic."
Porch Pro Headshot INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(18)
INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT Contractor: Alvaro Mendes 112Overlook St. Mt. Vernon NY,10552 Tel: (914) 330-0840 e-mail: innovation.inmgt@gmail.com www.innovationinmgt.com I would like to introduce our company INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT, a company that has been in business for interior f...Read more about INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT
INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT Contractor: Alvaro Mendes 112Overlook St. Mt. Vernon NY,10552 Tel: (914) 330-0840 e-mail: innovation.inmgt@gmail.com www.innovationinmgt.com I would like to introduce our company INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT, a company that has been in business for interior f...Read more about INNOVATION INTERIOR MANAGEMENT
Porch Pro Headshot AMIDONIAN llc
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(54)
Selected as the Best Remodeling Contractor, Delaware Reader's Choice Award 2016, our design and remodeling services focus on unique and personalized services and designs. We specialize in designing and building luxurious bathrooms, impressive closets, beautiful fireplaces, exceptional kitchens an...Read more about AMIDONIAN llc
Selected as the Best Remodeling Contractor, Delaware Reader's Choice Award 2016, our design and remodeling services focus on unique and personalized services and designs. We specialize in designing and building luxurious bathrooms, impressive closets, beautiful fireplaces, exceptional kitchens an...Read more about AMIDONIAN llc
Porch Pro Headshot Keystone Granite and Tile
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(52)
KNC Granite is a reputable company that provides countertop installation services to residents throughout Maryland. The licensed contractors at KNC can supply and install beautiful stones for your kitchen countertops, bathroom vanity or living room fireplace. Integrating stone into your furniture ca...Read more about Keystone Granite and Tile
KNC Granite is a reputable company that provides countertop installation services to residents throughout Maryland. The licensed contractors at KNC can supply and install beautiful stones for your kitchen countertops, bathroom vanity or living room fireplace. Integrating stone into your furniture ca...Read more about Keystone Granite and Tile

Frequently asked questions about remodeling contractors

The important steps to remember when finding a good local remodeling contractor:

Reviews - Check the contractor’s website and social media to see what their previous clients have said about their home remodeling work.

Past projects - Often, you’ll be able to find pictures of their previous work on their website or social media. If people are really happy with their remodeled home, they often post pictures on social media and then tag the remodeling contractor.

Up-to-date licenses - It would be useful to know what licenses and registration are needed for renovations companies in your state, and then make sure your contractor is up to standard.

Word of mouth - Generally people like to talk, so ask around for recommendations from your friends and neighbors to see if there is a top remodeling contractor in your community. It’s really important to hire someone you can trust, and if they already have a good reputation in your town, you can probably trust that they’ll treat you well too.

Compare prices - You can get a quote from a number of remodeling contractors or renovations companies to see who has the best going rate compared to the best reputation. Check to see how much each is charging for labor vs. the estimated cost of materials for the home remodeling.

Check out this article for more tips on hiring the best remodeling contractor for the job. It has further details on this topic.

Hiring a remodeling contractor can put you in a vulnerable position. Not only are you inviting someone you don’t know into your home, but you’re also allowing them to take your home apart and put it back together.

With this in mind, the following tips are recommended:

  • Have a written contract that outlines all the work to be completed and the pricing.
  • Note any additions to scope that come up as the project progresses, including additional materials and sizing issues.
  • Make sure the contractor is licensed and insured.
  • Ask for referrals and follow them up. Ask previous clients what they have to say about the work, including the quality and price, and whether the remodeling contractor stayed on budget.
  • Pay attention to the contractor’s style of communication and how he/she is able to communicate about the project. Are they willing to discuss details about their progress? Are they willing to be flexible?
  • Get a written estimate from the renovation company or remodeling contractor. Make sure it’s detailed and includes all the supplies needed, the rate per hour of work, and any other factors such as a timeline or special orders.

Depending on the project, you may be required to pay a deposit for the work. According to the National Association of the Remodeling Industry, “Receiving some sort of down payment at signing is a good practice to ensure a customer’s sincere intent to do the project. A payment schedule should be part of the contract language. Typical down payments are 25% to 33%. Sometimes even higher depending on the type of work being done. A down payment is highly recommended when products have to be ordered by the contractor immediately.”

You may be able to negotiate the percentage of the down payment, especially if you have established good communication with them. Ask your remodeling contractor what they expect and work out an agreeable percentage, but never pay the total cost upfront.

While it may be tempting to take on a remodeling project on your own, it's usually wise to hire a professional remodeling contractor for the job. Hiring a pro may save you money down the road because a pro can help you avoid costly mistakes and possible miscalculations. A remodeling contractor will carry liability and workers compensation insurance, which is set up to protect both the homeowner and contractor.

As you consider how to move forward with your home remodeling vision, you’ll have to consider which parts (if any) you can do yourself and what will have to be done professionally. For example, you may know how to paint a room, but don’t have the first clue about drywalling or knocking down a wall. These are things you probably don’t want to just take a swing at yourself.

These are some other issues people sometimes encounter when doing a DIY remodeling of their home:

  • Time — When it comes down to it, you simply don’t have the hours to put toward a home remodeling project.
  • Effort — What sounds simple enough in theory sometimes turns out to be rather laborious, and is no longer worth the DIY bragging rights.
  • Money — You may not save much money with a DIY project because you a) might cause damage, b) may need to redo some of your work, and c) may not get the materials for the same rate as the renovation company.

Having a solid plan up front will make hiring a remodeling contractor well worth your while.

Requirements for contractor licensing vary from state to state. Approximately 35 states require licenses. In some states, requirements for licensing are very lenient, so the licenses might not mean much to the consumer. In other states, a license means the contractor has a good track record.

Make sure licenses are up-to-date when hiring a renovations company or general contractor. Some states require different licensing categories and/or requirements, so it would be wise to read up on those of your state and check to see if your contractor’s license covers the type of work needed. Never hire a remodeling contractor that doesn’t have or can’t produce their license for working in your state, no matter their reason. Most states require that a license be obtained by any remodeling contractor performing work valued over $500.

With a license, the contractor should be up to date on current building codes, safety policies, disposal of hazardous materials, labor and employee hiring, and permitting. If the contractor doesn’t produce the paperwork, you may want to consider going in another direction.

Proof of a license does not always guarantee good work. Other than checking on a remodeling contractor’s license, homeowners should make sure a potential contractor carries liability and workers compensation insurance. Homeowners should scrutinize contractor’s reviews, look at a portfolio of past work, and look into a pro’s local reputation.

There are many factors involved when it comes to hiring a professional home remodeling contractor. Consider variables such as the complexity and size of the space being renovated, the cost and quality of materials, and the number of subcontractors and labor required.

Don’t go by the price itself, however. Though you’ll collect many estimates from remodeling contractors, don’t let price be the deciding factor. If you pay less, you may get less. Beware of any estimates that stand out as being lower (or higher, for that matter) than the rest.

Get several estimates and make sure they’re itemized (time, materials, costs, etc.) so you can compare various quotes. You may find that the higher cost is worth the money.

Some common things that will likely increase the cost of a remodeling contractor:

  • Electrical or plumbing work is involved.
  • The materials are imported.
  • The project is complex (several rooms, a particularly unique design, extra-heavy materials).
  • The time of year. Most people do their renovations in the late spring and summer, making it the season where demand allows for higher rates.

Consult the free Porch project cost guides to get an idea about how much a home renovation project may cost in your area.

The benefits of having one general contractor outweigh any other situation, including you trying to juggle all the different aspects of the project yourself. Hire a general contractor to manage subcontractors and schedule all the work.

There are many different types of contractors based on the kind of labor they’re trained in. For example, there are concrete contractors, HVAC contractors, closet contractors, kitchen contractors, and roofing contractors. Once you determine the specific work that needs to be done for your home remodeling project, you can look for a particular kind of contractor. If you need to remodel a whole room, you can get a contractor specific to that or to the kind of material you’ll be using, like drywall or plaster.

Since different types of contractors can potentially work on your home remodel, having a general contractor to outsource is the best way to go. When subcontractors are bringing on a crew, make sure that it’s a solid team and that everyone is on the same page with costs, materials, and the design of the remodeling vision. Everyone should know their work well and be properly licensed according to your state regulations.

Choosing a local remodeling contractor who knows the best local subcontractors is a smart way to go. Contractors and laborers often collaborate, especially in smaller towns. Making good contracting decisions will ensure that you’ll enjoy both the progress and results of your next home remodeling project. Remember that communication is the key to success. Setting reasonable expectations, establishing a good repertoire, and regularly checking in will lead to a smooth, easy home improvement project.

Recent reviews for Sunbury Remodeling Contractors

102450
404627

We engaged Teeters Construction (“Teeters “) to install a Simonton Sliding Patio door. They were recommended to us by the Simonton sales personnel at the Easton location in Columbus, Ohio. The Simonton patio door was installed on 9/13/16. We called and...

- Paul Weinberger
5430

Project was completed on time within budget and well done

5215

Very good work quality. Very responsive in communication. Very good value.

The kitchen and bathroom remodels was done on-time and within budget.

122400

Jim and team have replaced every window and exterior door in my house. He recently added new windows into our living room tp provide extra natural light. Amazing experience for all! Highly recommend!!

- Larissa Quinn Brophy
5405

My experience with Jim and his team has always been great!

5861

Excellent value. Excellent responsiveness in communication. Excellent work quality.

new windows and door for my family room. Love , Love all of it. The old door was just sitting on the floor...Jim had to rebuild the doorway and it's great. I know my house will be warn this winter!!!!

5191

Very good to keep appointment. Very responsive in communication. Very good work quality.

WE WERE GIVEN GREAT CUSTOMER SERVICE AND VERY GOOD CRAFTSMENSHIP

5202

Excellent responsiveness in communication. Excellent work quality. Excellent to keep appointment.

Very pleased. Worked quickly and efficiently and tried to accommodate us to limit disruption. Always showed at designated time and were very professional.

- Linda Schmidt
5205

Very responsive in communication. Excellent to keep appointment. Excellent value.

they have done two projects for me: taking down a wall and also remodeling a bathroom. Great job. Excellent attention to detail.

6362

Excellent to keep appointment. Excellent responsiveness in communication. Excellent work quality.

Prompt, courteous and professional.

23174

Jim is simply the best! He has replaced siding, windows, flooring, fixed plumbing problems, remodeled two bathrooms, and, most recently, remodeled my kitchen. All projects were done efficiently, priced fairly, and completed in a timely manner. He pays att...

- Sheryl Langner

Everything You Need to Know About Sunbury Remodeling Contractors

My Remodeling Contractors project in Sunbury is really small. How much should I expect to spend?

The lowest price we could find for remodeling contractors work in Sunbury is about $0.00. You should expect to pay at least this much depending on the scope of your project.

Remodeling Contractor work at this level can sometimes involve several steps or phases. Cost for every project will differ depending on the quality of Remodeling Contractor you hire, the type of materials required and the timeframe that you want to finish within.

How do I know I am getting a fair price for Remodeling Contractors work in Sunbury?

Every Remodeling Contractors job has different requirements. Remember that the price will differ depending on the scope of your project. However, that doesn't mean you have to go in blind. Check out our tips for getting a fair price for Sunbury work from Remodeling Contractorsbelow:

  • Talk to a few different Remodeling Contractors and ask for quotes to compare. We have around 50 professionals and companies in Sunbury for you to compare.
  • Before contacting a company, check out the ratings and reviews from previous customers to learn what others have paid, how long the Remodeling Contractors took on the job, and how satisfied they were.

How does invoicing/payment work for most Remodeling Contractor projects in Sunbury?

Every project differs, but you should ask any remodeling contractor for an estimate, before they do any work. In fact, ask for their general payment terms before any remodeling contractors work is done.

If the job is large and going to take longer than a day, it's common practice for remodeling contractors to request a down payment. Usually, this will be around 25% so they can commence work on your remodeling contractor project.

If it's a quick job, you'll likely be given an invoice/bill when the job is complete. Then it's up to you and the remodeling contractor to determine if you pay immediately or can send payment at a later date.

All Remodeling Contractors in Sunbury, OH

Porch Pro Headshot Beacom Construction Co LLC
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
Building improving around Cardington is made simple with the expertise of Beacom Construction Co LLC contractors in house and room addition work. The aesthetics of homes in Cardington are upgraded with house and room addition solutions. Jobs like house and room addition can entirely change a home's ...Read more about Beacom Construction Co LLC
Building improving around Cardington is made simple with the expertise of Beacom Construction Co LLC contractors in house and room addition work. The aesthetics of homes in Cardington are upgraded with house and room addition solutions. Jobs like house and room addition can entirely change a home's ...Read more about Beacom Construction Co LLC
Porch Pro Headshot Countryside Electric, Inc.
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
ABOUT: Founded in 1988, Countryside Electric, Inc. has a long history of providing excellent care for its customers and clients. If you're looking for professional, trusted electrical contractors, Countryside Electric, Inc. serves Columbus, New Albany, Westerville, Dublin, Pickerington and nearby c...Read more about Countryside Electric, Inc.
ABOUT: Founded in 1988, Countryside Electric, Inc. has a long history of providing excellent care for its customers and clients. If you're looking for professional, trusted electrical contractors, Countryside Electric, Inc. serves Columbus, New Albany, Westerville, Dublin, Pickerington and nearby c...Read more about Countryside Electric, Inc.
Porch Pro Headshot AIS Renovations
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(27)
A.I.S. Renovations Ltd. is a full scale remodeling company who specializes in all types of custom home improvement. We are capable of handling any job you have and our track record proves it. We have the experience and the know how to get the job done right the first time. Find out why our service a...Read more about AIS Renovations
A.I.S. Renovations Ltd. is a full scale remodeling company who specializes in all types of custom home improvement. We are capable of handling any job you have and our track record proves it. We have the experience and the know how to get the job done right the first time. Find out why our service a...Read more about AIS Renovations
Porch Pro Headshot JNP Construction Services, LLC
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(137)
JNP Construction Services is a family-owned business focused on providing high quality workmanship at reasonable rates. With over 50 years of combined experience there is not much we can't handle. Our services range from total remodels and room additions to 24 hr emergency service work and property ...Read more about JNP Construction Services, LLC
JNP Construction Services is a family-owned business focused on providing high quality workmanship at reasonable rates. With over 50 years of combined experience there is not much we can't handle. Our services range from total remodels and room additions to 24 hr emergency service work and property ...Read more about JNP Construction Services, LLC
Porch Pro Headshot T & L ROOFING & CONSTRUCTION
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(18)
The 5-star-rated T & L ROOFING & CONSTRUCTION in Sharpsburg will come in handy when you need new carpet installed.
The 5-star-rated T & L ROOFING & CONSTRUCTION in Sharpsburg will come in handy when you need new carpet installed.
Porch Pro Headshot Teeters Construction
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(22)
Teeters Construction in the Garrison, KY area are the experts to call for all window replacement needs and services.
Teeters Construction in the Garrison, KY area are the experts to call for all window replacement needs and services.
Porch Pro Headshot Mr. Tool Belt LLC
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
WWW.MRTOOLBELT.CO Mr. Tool Belt, LLC is a local handyman/remodeling company serving Central Ohio. All of our work comes with a 1 year warranty. At Mr. Tool Belt, LLC we guarantee the job is done right the first time so you can have peace of mind. All of our craftsmen have a minimum of 13 ye...Read more about Mr. Tool Belt LLC
WWW.MRTOOLBELT.CO Mr. Tool Belt, LLC is a local handyman/remodeling company serving Central Ohio. All of our work comes with a 1 year warranty. At Mr. Tool Belt, LLC we guarantee the job is done right the first time so you can have peace of mind. All of our craftsmen have a minimum of 13 ye...Read more about Mr. Tool Belt LLC
Porch Pro Headshot T&L Construction
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(1)
At T&L Construction we are here to fit a variety of your needs. We get the job done the right way the first time. We offer services as handyman to painting to electoral etc. Very professional and always on time. Never leave a mess behind either!! Feel free to give us a call today and experience wha...Read more about T&L Construction
At T&L Construction we are here to fit a variety of your needs. We get the job done the right way the first time. We offer services as handyman to painting to electoral etc. Very professional and always on time. Never leave a mess behind either!! Feel free to give us a call today and experience wha...Read more about T&L Construction
Porch Pro Headshot Custom Remodeling Concepts LLC
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(2)
With over 20 years' experience, Custom Remodeling Concepts takes great pride in the level of expertise, quality and customer service we provide ensuring that we meet or exceed our valued customers needs. It is our mission to provide excellent workmanship, and customer satisfaction, from start to fin...Read more about Custom Remodeling Concepts LLC
With over 20 years' experience, Custom Remodeling Concepts takes great pride in the level of expertise, quality and customer service we provide ensuring that we meet or exceed our valued customers needs. It is our mission to provide excellent workmanship, and customer satisfaction, from start to fin...Read more about Custom Remodeling Concepts LLC
Porch Pro Headshot Simple Bath Ohio
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
Simple Bath Ohio is a locally owned bathroom remodeling company specializing in providing custom, affordable solutions. We are comprised of a team of 15 individuals who are experts in just one thing - Bathroom Remodeling. We remodel between 500 and 600 bathrooms in Central Ohio each year, and our ...Read more about Simple Bath Ohio
Simple Bath Ohio is a locally owned bathroom remodeling company specializing in providing custom, affordable solutions. We are comprised of a team of 15 individuals who are experts in just one thing - Bathroom Remodeling. We remodel between 500 and 600 bathrooms in Central Ohio each year, and our ...Read more about Simple Bath Ohio
Porch Pro Headshot Robs Construction
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
(1)
We are a local company who specializes in general construction. We major in roofing,siding,floors and remodels
We are a local company who specializes in general construction. We major in roofing,siding,floors and remodels
Porch Pro Headshot Master Plan Remodeling
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
Porch Pro Headshot Thiel's Replacement Systems Inc./Thiel's Cabinet Restylers
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
Thiel's Replacement Systems/Thiel's Cabinet Restylers is a remodeling contractor from Ashland. They provide kitchen remodeling. Thiel's Replacement Systems/Thiel's Cabinet Restylers finished a kitchen remodeling project in October 2007 using a permit acquired from Massilon.
Thiel's Replacement Systems/Thiel's Cabinet Restylers is a remodeling contractor from Ashland. They provide kitchen remodeling. Thiel's Replacement Systems/Thiel's Cabinet Restylers finished a kitchen remodeling project in October 2007 using a permit acquired from Massilon.
Porch Pro Headshot M&K General Contracting LLC.
Remodeling Contractors
Serves Sunbury, Ohio
M & K General Contracting is a general contractor from Marion. They offer sunroom construction, accessibility construction and other services.
M & K General Contracting is a general contractor from Marion. They offer sunroom construction, accessibility construction and other services.

Latest projects near Sunbury

Recent projects booked on Porch
Sunbury 43074
Deck Construction
Start Date
I'm flexible
Service requested
Replace deck
Deck removed
No, pro should remove existing deck
Plans, drawings, blueprints
No, but I know what I want
Deck size (SQFT)
250 to 500 square feet
Surface and railing material
I'd like a professional recommendation
Structure material
Wood
Structural features
Custom stairs
Supplemental features
Something else
Materials included
No, pro must provide materials
Sunbury 43074
Deck Construction
Start Date
Within a year
Existing deck
No
Approximate size of deck to build
250-500 sq ft
Decking and railing materials
Synthetic or composite
Deck features
Multi-level deck
Other deck features
No, thanks, just the deck
Extent of design or prep work
Yes, I have sketches and a basic idea of what I want